Jay P. Greene's Blog

(Guest post by Brian Kisida)

Florida has a new Commissioner of Education.  They just announced that Virginia’s Secretary of Education, Gerard Robinson, will be taking over down in the sunshine state.  Congrats to Gerard.  As a former president of the Black Alliance for Education Options (BAEO) and a strong history of advocating for parental choice, education reform in Florida should continue to move forward and serve as an example for most other states.

To her credit, Diane Ravitch has offered an apology to Deborah Gist for having accused her of gross misbehavior.  Here is what she wrote:

… I reflected on a blog I wrote recently about my visit to Rhode Island. In that blog, I wrote harsh words about state Commissioner Deborah Gist. On reflection, I concluded that I had written in anger and that I was unkind. For that, I am deeply sorry.

Like every other human being, I have my frailties; I am far from perfect. I despair of the spirit of meanness that now permeates so much of our public discourse. One sees it on television, hears it on radio talk shows, reads it in comments on blogs, where some attack in personal terms using the cover of anonymity or even their own name, taking some sort of perverse pleasure in maligning or ridiculing others.

I don’t want to be part of that spirit. Those of us who truly care about children and the future of our society should find ways to share our ideas, to discuss our differences amicably, and to model the behavior that we want the young to emulate.

While this is a very positive development, it does not fully address the issue.  The main issue at this point is not Deborah Gist’s hurt feelings for having been accused (apparently wrongly) of exceptional rudeness and incivility; the main issue is Diane Ravitch’s credibility.  It is not enough for Ravitch to say that she is imperfect if the imperfection is about the very thing that makes everyone pay attention to her — her authority as an accurate chronicler of events.

To maintain her credibility Ravitch needs to give permission for the videotape of her meeting with Gist to be released.  Even if she is sorry or believes that she wrote in anger, she has still not spoken to the basic accuracy of her account.  If the video confirms her account, she could still be sorry but also be vindicated as a reliable source.  If the video does not confirm her account, she would be sorry and unreliable.  We still need to see the video and Ravitch should agree to release it.

In addition, there is something self-serving and potentially insincere about Ravitch’s generic denunciation of “the spirit of meanness that now permeates so much of our public discourse” coming only after she is potentially caught in making inaccurate allegations against others.  Ravitch’s meanness toward “the billionaire boys,” Joel Klein, Michelle Rhee, etc… has existed for some time without any concern from her about the nature of public discourse.

My concern about the sincerity of her newly expressed opposition to meanness is compounded by her use of the phrase:  “[t]hose of us who truly care about children…” by which I can only imagine that she includes herself and excludes her opponents.  Self-righteousness does not normally accompany contrition.

But perhaps Ravitch has turned a new leaf and is truly sorry for her own role in the meanness of public discourse.  The credibility of that contrition will have to be determined in light of her future writing and speaking, just as her credibility as a chronicler of events will have to be determined when she agrees to release the video.

It has now been 6 days since we asked Diane Ravitch to give permission for the release of videotapes that could verify or refute her allegation that she “never encountered such rudeness and incivility” as she did in her meeting with Rhode Island’s education commissioner, Deborah Gist.

Ravitch didn’t just make some off-hand remark about the meeting.  She publicly accused a public official of exceptionally bad behavior in an entire column in Education Week that was briefly re-posted in the Washington Post before it was mysteriously taken down, and that spawned two news articles.  And Diane Ravitch is a very important person, as she keeps reminding us.  She has met presidents, governors, all 14 Dalai Lamas, was Joan of Arc in a previous life, and has the ability to start fires with her mind.  She’s quite something.

Actually, I have no idea why she told the Providence newspaper that “Over the past half-century, I have met with many governors, state superintendents, congressmen, senators, Cabinet members, and every president since Lyndon B. Johnson (I met John F. Kennedy in 1958, when he was senator from Massachusetts)…. I have never encountered such behavior.”  Would we expect that presidents, governors, superintendents, etc… would be rude?  So Gist was more rude than a bunch of leaders who we wouldn’t expect to be rude.  I don’t get it.

If she had said that she rode with the Hell’s Angels, lived in Paris for a decade, and was a Hollywood talent agent and had never encountered such rudeness, I would have been impressed.  I mean, those people are normally considered quite rude.  But to be rude compared to a bunch of politicians who are normally very polite doesn’t seem to establish much other than Ravitch’s giant-sized ego.

Ravitch has raised the stakes by making this public accusation of gross misbehavior that has caused considerable headaches for Deborah Gist.  Now she has to deliver by agreeing to release the evidence.  Which is it — is she the credible historian who is bound by evidence or is she the ego-starved self-promoter who weaves stories to suit her purposes?  Her refusal to release the video so far tells us what the answer is.

It has now been 1 day since we asked Diane Ravitch to give permission for the videotapes to be released that could verify her allegations that Deborah Gist “dominated the conversation, interrupted me whenever I spoke, and filibustered to use up the limited time” when the two of them met with Rhode Island Governor Chafee and some aides.  Diane claims that she had “never encountered such rudeness and incivility.”

But Gist denies that the meeting was uncivil and Governor Chafee issued a statement to back her up, saying “Commissioner Gist comported herself in an appropriate and respectful way at all times during this discussion.”

Is Diane Ravitch an accurate chronicler of events or does she weave stories to suit her own purposes?  A video of the meeting would reveal the answer and it will be released if all parties give permission.  Gist has already done so and we are waiting for Ravitch.  It is day 1 and counting.

Ravitch has asked to review the tapes, which will take some time we hear because she is a very busy person.  As she keeps reminding us, she has met presidents, senators, governors, space aliens, divinities, etc… She’s a very important person.  Let’s see if she also is a reliable source of information or a weaver of self-serving stories.  When she reviews the tapes, Diane should be sure not to pull a Rose Mary Woods and have her foot accidentally hit the erase button.

Speaking of the Washington Post and scandals, we have another hint that Diane Ravitch’s  account of her “rude” encounter with Gist is unlikely to be supported by the videotape.  Diane Ravitch’s blog post was posted on the Washington Post blog operated by Valerie Strauss, a once-respectable reporter who is now the high-priestess of the Diane Ravitch Cult.  But after Chafee’s statement was released the piece was mysteriously taken down and no trace can be found of it at the Washington Post.

No trace except for the record that Google has of it.  If you type Diane Ravitch and Deborah Gist into a Google News search you will see the following item:

Ravitch on her visit with Chafee, Gist – The Answer Sheet – The …

 – 3:59am

May 11, 2011 … Education historian Diane Ravitch writes about her surprising visit … Chafee and Education Commissioner Deborah Gist, which didn’t turn out like Ravitch had expected.… How to find your favorite blogs on washingtonpost.com … years with veteran education writer Valerie Strauss and her guests. …
www.washingtonpost.com/…/post/ravitch-on…gist

As I’ve wondered before, how do we know whether historians, like Diane Ravitch, are actually reliable in their account of what happened?  Unlike quantitative empirical analyses, which can be replicated relatively easily by other scholars and have pretty well-established norms for quality work, we often have to rely on the authority of the historian and trust that he or she is accurate.  Yes, other historians can read the same original documents and dispute a historian’s interpretation, but few historians work on the same highly specialized questions and readers never know whether disputes among historians reveal a serious error of scholarship or just a reasonable difference of interpretation.

I bring all of this back up because there is a new dispute involving Diane Ravitch’s reliability in providing an accurate account of events.  The events involve a meeting she had with Rhode Island Governor, Lincoln Chafee, the state’s education Commissioner, Deborah Gist, and some aides.  Ravitch felt that Gist was rude, constantly interrupted her, and generally behaved in an unacceptable manner.

Ravitch was so insulted that she wrote a blog post about it.  According to her account of events:

Gist is clearly a very smart, articulate woman. But she dominated the conversation, interrupted me whenever I spoke, and filibustered to use up the limited time. Whenever I raised an issue, she would interrupt to say, “That isn’t happening here.” She came to talk, not to listen. It became so difficult for me to complete a sentence that at one point, I said, “Hey, guys, you live here all the time, I’m only here for a few hours. Please let me speak.” But Gist continued to cut me off. In many years of meeting with public officials, I have never encountered such rudeness and incivility. I am waiting for an apology.

Ravitch’s complaints generated an article in the Providence newspaper in which she elaborated on her interpretation of events:

“Over the past half-century, I have met with many governors, state superintendents, congressmen, senators, Cabinet members, and every president since Lyndon B. Johnson (I met John F. Kennedy in 1958, when he was senator from Massachusetts),” Ravitch wrote in an e-mail to The Journal Tuesday afternoon. “I have never encountered such behavior.”

Deborah Gist has a very different recollection of events.  According to Sean Cavanaugh’s reporting on this over at his Ed Week blog:

Gist remembers things differently. In an interview with me Friday afternoon, she described the session, which lasted 50 minutes, as a “productive meeting and a good conversation.”…

“I certainly didn’t feel like I’d been disrespected, and I didn’t feel that I’d disrespected her,” Gist told me. “I feel like it’s unfortunate that any of us are spending time on it, because we all have more important things to work on.”

Governor Chafee, who is not generally an ally of Commissioner Gist, confirms Gist’s account.  He issued the following statement after Ravitch raised a ruckus about Gist’s “rudeness”:

“I was very glad that Deborah Gist, our Commissioner of Education, was able to join me and several statewide labor leaders for a private conversation with Diane Ravitch during Ms. Ravitch’s recent visit toRhode Island. We enjoyed a lively discussion about many aspects of education reform. From my perspective, Commissioner Gist comported herself in an appropriate and respectful way at all times during this discussion.”

Which account should we believe?  Ravitch is a prominent authority on education and acclaimed historian, as she and her horde of acolytes repeatedly remind us.  If we can’t trust her to provide an accurate account of events in her own life, how are we supposed to trust her account of events in the past, pieced together from various archival documents.  If she just weaves a story to suit her purposes, regardless of its accuracy, that would be very worrisome.

Fortunately, there was also a documentary film-maker present who videotaped the exchange between Ravitch and Gist.  The film-maker is a bit skittish about getting involved in this controversy and so will only release the tape if all parties agree.  Gist has consented and Ravitch has asked to see the video before giving her permission.  This is an important test of Ravitch’s credibility.  If she is the reliable chronicler of events that she claims, she should be eager to have the video released to confirm her account.

So far she has not given permission, and there may be good reason why she may refuse ever to do so.  According to others who have viewed the tape, it does not support Ravitch’s account.  According to one source, Gist does interrupt Ravitch once during the 50 minute meeting while Ravitch interrupts Gist 6 times.  I can’t be sure whether this source is accurate, but the simple way to resolve this uncertainty is for Ravitch to allow the video to be released so we can all see the truth and know just how reliable she is.

There are good reasons to doubt Ravitch’s credibility.  First, the statement from Governor Chafee contradicts Ravitch’s account even though he has no particular motive to do so.  Second, Ravitch clearly has an inflated ego, thin-skin, and has been unreliable in other claims she has made. And third, Gist is eager to have the video released while Ravitch so far has not given her consent.  It sounds like Ravitch has more to hide.

Let’s see the video.  And if Ravitch does not allow it, we can assume what the video contains.